[Hockey Fan]

Not to sound like a USHL homer, or to pile on, but I'd bet the ranch that the USHL has produced far more NHL players the last 10 years than the IHL has. Certainly, there are some players on USHL rosters that may never play a shift of professional hockey and I acknowledge that. However, for many of these players, the USHL experience was not intended to be a spring-board to pro hockey, but rather to a college education. I will let the USHL's NHL player pedigree speak for itself. Not to mention that I believe there are four USHL alumni on Team USA's Olympic squad.

Also, I doubt anyone questions the pedigree of the players in the OHL, WHL, and QMJ. Those leagues, while technically "junior leagues" are major juniors and I would say about a half step above the USHL in overall talent and depth. Having said that, let us not forget that prior the 2007-2008 season the Omaha Lancers and the Indian Ice traveled to Quebec to take part in a round-robin exhibition tournament series against the Rimouski Oceanic and the Quebec Remparts, two storied franchises in the "Q". Omaha went undefeated, outscoring Quebec and Rimouski (Sid Crosby's junior team) 9-2. Indiana, while losing to both teams, fell 5-3 to Quebec and suffered a 6-5 SO loss to Rimouski. In both games, Indy held leads in the third period.

To dismiss the USHL out of hand because they are high school aged players is selling the leaugue far too short. As has been mentioned previously, the level of skill and and overall talent is very high as the teams are comprised of the best 16-20 year olds in the United States.

I think Musky folks, if true hockey fans, will give the USHL a shot (because their choices are very limited at this point). If you enter the game with an open mind, you will leave pleasantly surprised.

This post has been edited by Hockey Fan: 11 February 2010 - 11:01 AM

[Kyle Hunt]

How many total players in the ushl and how many in the ihl?

[WahooLancer]

Agree with Yeti on what is great about the USHL. As I said, in the recent past, Omaha had an AHL team, D-1 college hockey, and USHL Hockey. Granted, out of those three teams, the Lancers have been around the longest, but Omaha is not a town that didn't know what pro hockey is all about.

Out of the 3 hockey teams, my least favorite of the bunch was AHL hockey. Granted, these guys were super skilled. The speed and passing were certainly above what you would see in a college game or USHL game. However, AHL games lacked "passion" and "commitment to the city." Guys in the AHL weren't tied to the Omaha community at all, I understand that. They all want to make the NHL, and that makes sense. But players got called up to Calgary, demoted to the ECHL, traded, or whatever on a regular basis. Rarely did the Knights have the same 20 guys in the lineup. Players could really have cared less about Omaha, and while the play reflected incredible skill and speed, games rarely had any passion to them at all.

UHSL hockey, players stay with host families. Lots of these kids still go to high school or college. They are very active and visable in the community. The players on a USHL team talk to fans, talk to your kids, and seem to enjoy living in your town. They "become part of your community." Thus, while the play is less skilled and does not have the speed of pro hockey, the passion that teams play with in Junior Hockey is amazing. My father taught high school for 38 years, and over the years had numerous Lancers in his class. Almost every player my Dad ever had in class was an above average to excellent student, always very curtious and polite, and generally a great kid to have in class. Thus, I got to know a ton of these players of a personal level, and I consider alot of these kids almost like being a little brother. After I got married and had kids, players would always take a few minutes to talk to my kids and spend some time with them. Obviously, when you get this "connected" with the players and staff of an organization, it is really easy to get very passionate about "your team". My wife jokes that if I cut myself shaving that I would bleed orange and black (Go Lancers).

Again, I can understand how frustrating it would be to lose "your team." A few years ago, some dead beat bought the Lancers and then managed to get indicted for loan fraud based on his purchase of the Lancers. The Lancers went into bankruptcy and looked like they might have to fold. Although I would still have been a huge UNO Maverick fan, it still wouldn't have been the same as my passion for the Lancers. Fortunately, Luc Robitalle (sp), Mike Eruizoine (sp), Ben Robert ,and Mario Lemieux (sp) purchased the Lancers and the organization if doing OK (maybe not great, but better) at this time.

So, I ask, at least go see a couple USHL games and see what you think, you might be surprised.

Tom
Wahoo, NE

[USHLfan]

Yeti, on 11 February 2010 - 09:01 AM, said:

If my "dolts" comment offended anyone's delicate sensibilities, I apologize. I have no problem with the hockey fans in Muskegon who are informed, educated, and are willing to give the USHL a shot. However, I do have a problem with people slamming the USHL without doing any research first. I understand the hockey fans in that town are upset, as they should be. But don't take your anger out on a league, or your team, just because you're pissed off. Mr. Rico and Wahoo have done a great job here showing why so many of us love the USHL. I hope the fans in Muskegon at least give it a shot. I'd hate to see the fans there turn their noses to the USHL just because it's "a bunch of high school kids." That's bogus. That kind of ignorance is what could kill the USHL franchise in that city. I'm confident the TRUE hockey fans in Muskegon will embrace the USHL team, and will learn to love junior hockey. Like many others who have posted here, I've seen a ton of hockey over the years. I've played hockey for the past 20 years. In my opinion, it doesn't get any better than the USHL. Best bang for the buck.

It is a matter of civility. Referring to one as a "dolt" does little to make your case, creates barriers to communication, offends those involved, and runs counter to the culture of this board. It would be far better to help erase any misconception Muskegon fans may have of the USHL without having to resort to name calling. Those that reject your opinions on the virtues of the USHL should not be condemned for doing so, it is their decision to make as they are simply trying to maximize their utility.

Personally, I would like to see all of the fans come back next year, however, I will not think one a dolt, or uneducated if they decide otherwise and nor should you.

[Mr Ricochet]

IHLfan, on 11 February 2010 - 12:40 PM, said:

It is a matter of civility. Referring to one as a "dolt" does little to make your case, creates barriers to communication, offends those involved, and runs counter to the culture of this board.

Nothing can some up what this board was created to be better than IHLfan has posted. Indeed we are all fans in one way or another and have our allegiances, but name calling is poison to a board. There is only one condition to be a member of this board and that is civility. After that game on........

Yeti I could have deleted or PMed you about your comment but instead chose to leave it to be read and answered it with an explanation of what Musky hockey has been for 50 years. It was my opinion that route was a better one as it was a chance to share with those who don't know what a Musky fan is thinking right now...... Truth be told, indeed IMO some of those comments deserve being categorized as dolt like, but it's poison to do so and not can, but WILL, wreck a board.

USHL fans, question. 2 IHL teams had a nasty battle where team A's 260 pounder mutilated team B's non-fighter. Team B went out and got 3 ruffians for the next game, which was a home game for team B, to get some get back. Team B has been averaging 1,500 a game. When it was reported in the papers that team B was bringing in 3 ruffians for the rematch they sold 3,000+ tickets!!! The game had it's line brawl and the fans went nuts.

Hack hockey to a USHL fan? Most would say yes. I have season tix to the Steel but loved this drama and game within the game. The entertainment value of that episode and a different feel that comes from no instigator hockey brings the sport back to pre 1990 and to its origins. Old Time Hockey!!! Two different sets of fans used to different types of hockey.

Is one set of fans stupid and the other not for liking or disliking Old Time Hockey, or enjoying non Euro penalty parade hockey? I think no, just a matter of preference. And I prefer both and put my money in the gas tank and travel state to state as proof.


The word fan derives from the word fanatic. That's what we all are at some level. I love to bill myself as a fan of a sport and not a jersey, but realize I'm way in the minority there. As fanatics we need to understand we are not in our home arena cheering our team and league when we post at FYC. I'm not even asking objectivity only civility.

There are obviously some very sharp hockey minds here, that should be tapped into to make each other a smarter and more well rounded hockey fan. Lets keep that in mind and realize we all have a lot more in common than not. The diversity of us all as we share our hockey knowledge and experiences should be a good thing, not a bad one.

I have held the belief that USHL fans are here to inform Musky fans what the USHL is, not sell it!!! At least that's what I'm trying to do,and hope others do as well. Let's see if we can accomplish that and Musky fans will either support their new team or they won't!

[Yeti]

I've edited my original post. Again, I apologize if I offended anyone. That wasn't my intent.

I guess I have a bit of a "bunker mentality" when I see people thumb their nose to junior hockey, and the USHL in particular, just because it isn't "pro" hockey. I understand that they are entitled to that opinion, but my issue was with people who know nothing about the USHL, nor have they attended a game, yet won't give it a chance. That type of ignorance is not going to help fill seats in Muskegon.

Hockey is hockey, in my opinion. Even if you don't like it, and it isn't what you've been used to watching the past 50 years, it's better than no hockey at all.

This post has been edited by Yeti: 11 February 2010 - 02:07 PM

[Old Jacks]

Yeti, on 11 February 2010 - 01:55 PM, said:

I've edited my original post. Again, I apologize if I offended anyone. That wasn't my intent.

I guess I have a bit of a "bunker mentality" when I see people thumb their nose to junior hockey, and the USHL in particular, just because it isn't "pro" hockey. I understand that they are entitled to that opinion, but my issue was with people who know nothing about the USHL, nor have they attended a game, yet won't give it a chance. That type of ignorance is not going to help fill seats in Muskegon.

Hockey is hockey, in my opinion. Even if you don't like it, and it isn't what you've been used to watching the past 50 years, it's better than no hockey at all.

Maybe, but is it worth hundreds or thousands of dollars to buy season tickets to find out? I think that most STHs have a familiarity with the differant levels of hockey and place a value on each. It sounds like the prices in the USHL will be similar to the IHL so no I myself don't consider that a good value. I have other hockey options both professional and amatuer that I'll take advantage of.

[gbgamblers40]

I just have to say I am loving every read on this post!! I am a huge Gamblers fan and believe me a bigger fan of the USHL. As many of the USHL posters know in this league one year you can be horrid the next you can be the class of the league. The league is very entertaining and I don't know of a team that does not play tough every night. (Team USA's U17 is not on par but...) I can't believe I am going to agree with a Steel fan (sorry) Mr. R is right if The LJ's can get a team that is tough and hard nose its first year the transition will be easy.

O and the trash talking have fun trying to beat the Gamblers buddy. No one else can! haha

[Mr Ricochet]

gbgamblers40, on 13 February 2010 - 02:55 AM, said:

O and the trash talking have fun trying to beat the Gamblers buddy. No one else can! haha

Wow, a new USHL fan that actually posts and contributes instead of just lurking!! Nice, and welcome to FYC!! ....... Nobody can beat the Gamblers? How many cups do you guys have? I know the Gamblers win the title for most majors every year, but I missed them winning a cup!!

For the benefit of new Musky fans would you agree the Gamblers are probably the least liked team in the league followed by Waterloo cuz of their fans at Young Arena? Maybe throw Lincoln into the mix as well cuz they play so physical and like to drop em as well?

Also for the benefit of new Musky fans we had another donnybrook last night. Second goalie fight in two weeks for the league!!! Game story. http://www.theindepe...2e220139750.txt


Period 2
Tri-City - Radoslav Illo - (Slashing), 2 min, 5:08
Lincoln - Matt Bruneteau - (Holding), 2 min, 9:28
Tri-City - Rick Pinkston - (Delay of Game), 2 min, 12:28
Tri-City - Rick Pinkston - (Unsportsmanlike Conduct), 2 min, 12:28
Lincoln - Matt Bruneteau - (Delay of Game), 2 min, 12:28
Lincoln - Matt Bruneteau - (Unsportsmanlike Conduct), 2 min, 12:28
Lincoln - Dominik Shine - (Elbowing), 2 min, 12:28
Lincoln - Austin Handley - (High Sticking), 2 min, 13:46
Tri-City - Cody Murphy - (Fighting Major), 5 min, 14:53
Lincoln - Cory Hibbeler - (Fighting Major), 5 min, 14:53
Tri-City - Carsen Chubak - (Fighting Major), 5 min, 15:16
Tri-City - Carsen Chubak - (Fighting Game Misconduct), 10 min, 15:16
Tri-City - Tyler Pistone - (Fighting Major), 5 min, 15:16
Tri-City - Tyler Pistone - (Fighting Game Misconduct), 10 min, 15:16
Tri-City - Michael Montrose - (Fighting Major), 5 min, 15:16
Tri-City - Michael Montrose - (Fighting Game Misconduct), 10 min, 15:16
Tri-City - T.J. Schlueter - (Fighting Major), 5 min, 15:16
Tri-City - T.J. Schlueter - (Fighting Game Misconduct), 10 min, 15:16
Lincoln - Dominik Shine - (Fighting Major), 5 min, 15:16
Lincoln - Dominik Shine - (Fighting Game Misconduct), 10 min, 15:16
Lincoln - Ryan Dzingel - (Fighting Major), 5 min, 15:16
Lincoln - Ryan Dzingel - (Fighting Game Misconduct), 10 min, 15:16
Lincoln - Sam Alfieri - (Fighting Major), 5 min, 15:16
Lincoln - Sam Alfieri - (Fighting Misconduct), 10 min, 15:16
Lincoln - Austin Handley - (Fighting Major), 5 min, 15:16
Lincoln - Austin Handley - (Fighting Game Misconduct), 10 min, 15:16
Lincoln - Jared Coreau - (Fighting Major), 5 min, 15:16
Lincoln - Jared Coreau - (Fighting Game Misconduct), 10 min, 15:16
Tri-City - Tyler Amburgey - (Fighting Major), 5 min, 15:16
Lincoln - Will Rayner - (Fighting Major), 5 min, 15:16
Tri-City - Maxwell Tardy - (Fighting Major), 5 min, 15:16
Tri-City - Maxwell Tardy - (Fighting Game Misconduct), 10 min, 15:16
Tri-City - Mitch Hughes - (Slashing), 2 min, 18:36

[Jamie]

Hey Mr. R., Your saying were the most hated team in the league right now because were winning???? Were play Hockey the way it supposed to be played!! Physical, hard hitting, and Trash talking is the way hockey should be???? If people don't like seeing that, you better pick a different sport to watch!!!!!

I agree with you on Waterloo, on most of there fans being a-holes(not all of them, we meet a few good ones on our trips) but all arena have a few A-holes at them but that's the way Waterloo always have been and it still a blast going there!!!! Now for Lincoln, they are not hated!!! That is by far the best place in the league to go watch a game, The atmosphere is awesome!!!!!!!!

Also by the Way!!! You ask MR R.!!!!! How many titles the Gamblers one!!!!! Lets see!!!

Anderson Cup Champions

1995-96
1996-97
2008-09

Clark Cup Champions

1995-96
1999-00

So I can say The Gamblers won a Few Championships!!!!

Looks like Chicago is going to win a title again!!! Fudging there attendance numbers!!!!!!!!!

This post has been edited by Jamie: 13 February 2010 - 09:55 AM

[Mr Ricochet]

Never did you hear me say the word hate Jamie. You'll never find a person who likes 3rd and 4th lines more than me and bust people type hockey. Conversely you'll never find anyone who dislikes fighters being sent out to fight non-fighters, flying elbows,knee to knees, running goalies, but ends, spears or helicpotering a stick like Seckel has down pat.

I'm not saying all these fit Cooper's Gamblers, but the shoe fits on many instances. At least from what I've seen of them every game,save for the last one in Chicago.

Thanks for clearing up the Gamblers history, as I was indeed incorrect. The Steel's attendance? Not bad actually. You wouldn't know about this too much being in GB, but getting people to the arena to see jr hockey in Chicago is tough. People have NHL and 2 AHL franchises as hockey choices and the great MWEHL as well. Add to that world class shopping, restaurants,plays,mueseums, art and indeed it's a tough sell. You are again correct Jamie.

Steel cups? ZERO with no prospects on the horizon. If it was only a winning playoff team that I would support, indeed I wouldn't have been to many Steeeeeeeel games. But I'll keep showing up and hoping for better.......

[Jamie]

Sorry, Mr R. you did not say Hated, I read that wrong!!!! I agree with you that Seckel is not the cleanest player out on the ice but the Kids plays with a big heart and skates his ass off every time he is on the ice!!!!!!

I know its a hard sell in Chicago, we go down there for almost every game when there playing the Gamblers!!!! It a really nice and well maintained arena and I wish more people would so up. Green Bay has the same Problem early in the season with our attendance! Chicago has it worst because like you said, it's Chicago and you have so many other options to do there!!!

We are all die hard fans, I know what its like, GB was way worst off a few years ago than what Chicago is right now, your time will come!!!

Keep up the good work and Good luck tonight against Omaha and keep fighting for that last playoff spot!!!!!

This post has been edited by Jamie: 13 February 2010 - 10:30 AM

[Fangers]

Jamie, on 13 February 2010 - 09:38 AM, said:

Hey Mr. R., Your saying were the most hated team in the league right now because were winning???? Were play Hockey the way it supposed to be played!! Physical, hard hitting, and Trash talking is the way hockey should be???? If people don't like seeing that, you better pick a different sport to watch!!!!!

While I love hard hitting physical games, I can do without all the chippiness behind the play and cheap shots. I can also do without all the trash talking - talk with your play, not your mouth! You hear all the time from NHL vets who bemoan the fact that many of the younger players coming in don't have the respect for each other (and the increase in cheap/head shots) and I think that trash talking is major reason for the respect issue. And it's trickling down to the lowest level of youth hockey (well, all sprots for that matter)...

[Jamie]

Trash Talking happens in every sport!!!! That's what makes a good rivalry!!! If there wasn't any trash talking I dont think any of the cheap shots or fights would break out during the games.

This post has been edited by Jamie: 13 February 2010 - 11:05 AM

[Fangers]

Jamie, on 13 February 2010 - 11:04 AM, said:

Trash Talking happens in every sport!!!! That's what makes a good rivalry!!! If there wasn't any trash talking I dont think any of the cheap shots or fights would break out during the games.

Thank you for making my point...and if you think that is what makes for a good rivalry, well, let's just say we don't agree and leave it at that...

[Brett]

Best of luck to Muskegon, Tim Taylor and Josh Mervis. They definitely made the right call on leaving the IHL. Mervis offered Bloomington a team for the last two years with solid guarantees and gave the current owners an option of returning their investment in the woeful PrairieThunder.

Bloomington blew it and will be begging Mervis and the USHL to let them in the league in the near future.

[Mr Ricochet]

Jamie, on 13 February 2010 - 10:25 AM, said:

Sorry, Mr R. you did not say Hated, I read that wrong!!!! I agree with you that Seckel is not the cleanest player out on the ice but the Kids plays with a big heart and skates his ass off every time he is on the ice!!!!!!

No need to apologize Jamie. If you think someone is short changing your club by all means set the record straight,like you did with me.

Even if the Steel were to win the cup I don't think they would draw. Up until last year I don't think the team had an advertising budget. But the last two years the Steel have done a nice job getting out to schools, advertising and having some nice promotions. They don't draw 200-300 per game anymore and are legitimately getting 1,200-1,300 and a few times this year had 2,000+. The place only seats 2,400 or so..... It's tough competing for a hockey dollar in this town and I'll also add they don't get one word of coverage from any news source.

I have no basis in fact for this, but I think the league and the NHL wants Chicago in the league and will see that it is. First of all the league offices are here and it is very easy for scouts to get to the Edge while their NHL team is in town or their AHL teams are in town at Rockford or at the Wolves..... Next time you're at the Edge look up at the middle boxes. A lot of scouts.

If you saw my post game thoughts when the Gamblers were here 2 weeks ago I wrote they showed a lot of restraint. I counted 4 times that Summerhays was sent to the ice and the Gamblers didn't retaliate,when they had every right to. That would not of happened last year. Cooper would have made sure there were 150 PIM, and got the win. Of course the Steel may have been paying the Gamblers back for games in GB I didn't see, I don't know.

This is a different GB team than last years IMO. Obviously very well coached but they show more focus IMO. Sure they are chippy but last year it was often like watching Slap Shot when they came to town. Big difference between dirty and chippy.

And IMO no team is more prepared or better coached than the Gamblers. Maybe as well as, but not better than. Plus GB will hit you all game long. What's not to like, as I said earlier.

If they get out of the East it will make for a great Finals........

[Fargo Force Blogger]

Yeti, on 11 February 2010 - 08:01 AM, said:

If my "dolts" comment offended anyone's delicate sensibilities, I apologize. I have no problem with the hockey fans in Muskegon who are informed, educated, and are willing to give the USHL a shot. However, I do have a problem with people slamming the USHL without doing any research first. I understand the hockey fans in that town are upset, as they should be. But don't take your anger out on a league, or your team, just because you're pissed off. Mr. Rico and Wahoo have done a great job here showing why so many of us love the USHL. I hope the fans in Muskegon at least give it a shot. I'd hate to see the fans there turn their noses to the USHL just because it's "a bunch of high school kids." That's bogus. That kind of ignorance is what could kill the USHL franchise in that city. I'm confident the TRUE hockey fans in Muskegon will embrace the USHL team, and will learn to love junior hockey. Like many others who have posted here, I've seen a ton of hockey over the years. I've played hockey for the past 20 years. In my opinion, it doesn't get any better than the USHL. Best bang for the buck.

Yeah the USHL has a ton to offer. Just look at how USA hockey is developing. A lot of the US Junior roster had USHL experience...(4 current USHLers and 6 former players)...and I know that there are a couple of players on the Olympic roster that played in the USHL that Yeti can tell you about. He got to see Backes....Brian Rafalski, Paul Stastny, Joe Pavelski and Ryan Malone are the other USHLers on the Olympic roster. I don't know anything about the IHL really so I wouldn't know if they would have any olympians on any of the rosters (yes, ignorance on my part...but it's too late to do research).

Here's a list of former USHL players drafted in the NHL

The best part about that list is that the number of draft picks the USHL is putting in the NHL continues to get higher and they are picking them sooner too (more 1st-2nd rounders than ever). With the addition of the USNTDP, you will get to see some really good potential NHLers.

This post has been edited by Fargo Force Blogger: 22 February 2010 - 01:57 AM

[Thunderbolt]

Here's the FULL press conference... six parts.

Part 1 - Jeff Patulski, Skip Prince - http://www.youtube.c...h?v=s--Twdbmoiw

Part 2 - Prince, Josh Mervis, Mayor Steve Warmington - http://www.youtube.c...h?v=iti_swE6du4

Part 3 - Warmington, Justin Abdelkader, Questions (Ticket price, Taylor, More expansion, Prince; Why Muskegon, Mervis; Why chose USHL, Abdelkader) - http://www.youtube.c...h?v=wwhscMIn4ZE

Part 4 - More questions (How team stocked, Prince; Patulski/Taylor involvement, Jeff Patulski; one-on-one Q's, Stacy Patulski, Mervis, ) - http://www.youtube.c...h?v=ylCrO6lJCe4

Part 5 - More one-on-ones (Abdelkader, Prince) - http://www.youtube.c...h?v=fP2vm6TRzTY

Part 6 - More one-on-ones (Prince) - http://www.youtube.c...h?v=gFzOuJo9q8M

[Mr Ricochet]

Thanks for your effort Tbolt!!!!

Just saw this article as well. http://www.ushl.com/...ory.cfm?id=3048

Quote

The USHL's entry into the Michigan market makes for two Michigan-based teams, as the Ann Arbor-based National Team Development Program, operated directly by USA Hockey, joined the League this year as a full Member. The League's growth in the Michigan market is appropriate, as this season, for the first time in its history, more players in the USHL hail from the state of Michigan than any other state (a distinction held until this year by Minnesota).

Didn't realize this. Musky will get a ton of family following their kids to Musky as visitors. I know the people I have met in Chicago have driven and flown from all over the country to see their kids play....... Not to mention the Michiganders who will play for the USHL Jacks!!